Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/ATCO Field

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. The consensus is not a delete, therefore default keep. Merge can be discussed on talkpage. Tone 16:17, 17 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

ATCO Field

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

No unique material from what is contained at Spruce Meadows. Not sure it requires a stand-alone article which is why I changed it to a redirect. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Alberta-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Merge back into the parent article, at least for now - the stadium doesn't have independent notability from the compound yet. SportingFlyer T·C 00:58, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Clearly notable in itself by sports venue notability guidelines.--Gri3720 (talk) 01:00, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Spruce Meadows is the notable venue, not ATCO Field. TrailBlzr (talk) 04:12, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - As far as sporting venues go, sports venue notability guidelines specifically state that the stadium would notable while not specifically mentioning that Spruce Meadows would be notable. Therefore the argument that the latter is more notable than the former falls short.--Gri3720 (talk) 20:07, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Merge No reason to have a separate article yet, ATCO Field is part of Spruce Meadows and belongs in that article. TrailBlzr (talk) 04:10, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Merge Please don't make tautological arguments, even if sports venues are usually kept, there's no reason it can't be covered in a connected article. Reywas92^Talk 06:52, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 10:03, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep as it is a standalone ground at a wider sports facility, following precedent of Headingley Stadium (which has Headingley Cricket Ground and Headingley Rugby Stadium within it). GiantSnowman 10:05, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Compare the size of those articles to these. There's enough to sustain separate articles for the English examples but not for the Canadian ones. Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:31, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - In agreement with the points made above. Also, ATCO Field is not a separate entity within Spruce Meadows, it is the commercial name for the pitch on which Cavalry FC play their matches. A better comparison is Cameron Indoor Stadium, an arena which contains the main basketball court known officially as "Coach K Court". We don't have a Coach K Court article for the same reasons we shouldn't have an ATCO Field article, they're interchangeable with their larger parent entities. TrailBlzr (talk) 01:20, 11 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - It is the sponsor name for the stadium on the grounds of Spruce Meadows. The sponsor company is https://www.atco.com/en-ca/contact-us.html . Walter Görlitz (talk) 01:32, 11 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per above. Anchor506 (talk) 20:00, 10 May 2019 (UTC) — Anchor506 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
- This !vote was blocked for long-term abuse by JJMC89. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:03, 10 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - ATCO field is a soccer stadium within a much bigger facility. There are many similar examples in Canada such as Centennial Park Stadium separate from Centennial Park (Toronto), York Lions Stadium separate from York University, Exhibition Stadium and BMO Field separate from Exhibition Place, Empire Stadium (Vancouver) separate from Hastings Park, Swangard Stadium separate from Central Park (Burnaby), Saputo Stadium and Olympic Stadium (Montreal) separate from Olympic Park, Montreal. I'm hard-pressed for a Canadian example that's otherwise, where the primary article is for the larger facility. It's pretty easy to see a lot of media coverage of ATCO Field - clearly meets WP:GNG Nfitz (talk) 19:35, 12 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- No, they use the same field for equestrian events as they do soccer matches. ATCO Field is the commercial name for the pitch when hosting soccer matches. Spruce Meadows is not some giant urban park like Exhibition Place, it's a sports venue. TrailBlzr (talk) 03:23, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - According to our articles User:TrailBlzr, Spruce Meadows is very large at 360 acres - much larger than the 240 acres at Exhibition Place. As the area of a football pitch is about 0.2 acres - surely Spruce Meadows is indeed a giant park-like facility partially in the city of Calgary that is much more than just a football pitch! Nfitz (talk) 13:10, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - Yet the CBC article clearly discusses how they have a plan to replace the divots in the soccer pitch after the equestrian events. Walter Görlitz (talk) 14:43, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      - Just because they will use the soccer pitch for other sports doesn't mean that the entire 360 acre facility is ATCO field or a soccer pitch! They have other CNE events at BMO Field than football or even sports, without BMO Field being just Exhibition Place. Nfitz (talk) 15:01, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep The soccer field is a separate facility from the equestrian facility, the articles are not the same at all. Smartyllama (talk) 12:49, 13 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment No, it's actually the same facility. The two sports share the same ground. ATCO is simply the sponsor name of soccer field. the only difference is that the horses have additional stables and facilities on the larger ground. The linked CBC article makes that clear: "'We think we've got an eloquent solution to host both sports in a very unique way,' said Spruce Meadows senior vice-president Ian Allison" and "Test runs last summer made both Allison and Wheeldon Jr. confident the grass can recover from pounding hooves for crosses and corner kicks." There's a video by a Vancouver Whitecaps FC supporter's group that also makes that clear. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:05, 13 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  - Not, it's not the same facility. The article is clear that the equestrian facility is hundreds of acres big. A soccer pitch is 0.2 acres. Like many (if not most) of the football pitches in Canada, ATCO field is within a bigger facilty that has it's own article. Nfitz (talk) 15:01, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    - You have my argument backward: this stadium is a shared facility within the larger equestrian grounds and is the only venue where show jumping is observed. It's different from other articles because there's not enough to sustain an article for the shared-use stadium. Walter Görlitz (talk) 17:16, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      - As per the references, the grass surface of the field will be used for equestrian events 4-5 weeks per year. As the football team will use the field much more than that, it is primarily a football stadium in which some equestrian events will be held for a short period of time and not the opposite. Under this logic, it is primarily a football stadium which clearly distinguishes it from Spruce Meadows which has been an exclusively equestrian venue since 1975.--Gri3720 (talk) 19:23, 14 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Spruce Meadows per WP:PAGEDECIDE. "ATCO Field" is a useful search term, but the content should be a section of Spruce Meadows rather than a stand-alone article, per the merge arguments above and the sources (which focus more on "Spruce Meadows" and the "Cavalry FC" than on "ATCO Field"). Leviv ich 19:37, 15 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. I think the article has sufficient references/content to establish notability. A standalone article is fine, but I wouldn't object to the content being merged into Spruce Meadows. TimBuck2 (talk) 15:05, 17 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.